Why is my sale stuck in purchasing? And what can I do about it!!

In this episode of 'The Luxury of Choice', host Steve Vaughan, along with guests Jayne and Jonathan, delve into the common phrase 'my order is stuck in purchasing'. They explore the implications of this phrase on sales forecasting and revenue projections, the importance of understanding the buying process, and the necessity of engaging with purchasing teams early in the sales process to mitigate delays. The conversation emphasizes the human aspect of purchasing and the need for salespeople to build relationships with purchasing professionals to facilitate smoother transactions. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the intricacies of the buying process, emphasizing the importance of understanding customer relationships, particularly with purchasing departments. They discuss the challenges salespeople face, including fear and preparation, and highlight the significance of addressing terms and conditions early in the sales process. The conversation concludes with insights on leveraging purchasing departments as enablers in achieving sales goals.

Key Takeaways :

• The phrase 'my order is stuck in purchasing' often indicates a breakdown in communication between sales and purchasing.
• Salespeople should engage with purchasing teams early to understand their processes and requirements.
• Understanding the customer buying process is crucial for sales success.
• Building relationships with purchasing professionals can lead to smoother transactions.
• Salespeople often overlook the importance of the purchasing process in their sales strategy.
• Purchasing teams are not the enemy; they are part of the sales process.
• Salespeople should educate themselves on the buying process to better navigate it.
• Effective forecasting in sales requires close collaboration with purchasing teams.
• Purchasing can be overwhelmed by demands from both sales and internal teams.
• Engaging with purchasing early can help avoid delays and complications. Understanding the buying process is crucial for successful sales.

Steve Vaughan, Jonathan Cooper, Pru Layton, Christian Walter, Pascal le Floche and Jayne Green are Sales Trainers from george james ltd. You can email the show at: Podcast@georgejames-training.com

The trainers on LinkedIn:

Steve Vaughan https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-vaughan-salestrainer/
Jonathan Cooper https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-cooper-18716b1/
Pru Layton https://www.linkedin.com/in/pru-layton-b46a3528/
Christian Walter https://www.linkedin.com/in/christian-walter-a1857b1/
Jayne Green https://www.linkedin.com/in/jayne-green-salestrainer/
Pascal Le Floch-Riche https://www.linkedin.com/in/pascal-le-floch-220ba46/


george james training website https://georgejames-training.com/

Transcript

Hello again, and welcome to the luxury choice, a B2B sales and business podcast brought to you by the training team of George James limited. My name is Steve Vaughan. I'm a senior sales trainer at George James, and I'm also the host and producer of the Of this podcast. And it's our first podcast of 2025.

And incredibly it's a new year. I don't know where the years go to these days. I know when I was a kid, my mother used to say, when you get older, the years fly by. I used to think what a load of nonsense, but she was absolutely right. Today I've got I've got Jayne and Jonathan with me. So Jayne, Jonathan, I don't know how long we're supposed to say happy new year for, but I'm going to say it anyway.

Happy new year to you both. Yes.

 Happy new year, Steve. Happy new year, Steve. Yeah. It's absolutely fine. I think somebody once said to me, it could be the end of, you know, up to the end of January [00:01:00] seemed, seemed a little excessive, but Hey, that's a, that's a, it's all good. It's absolutely new year. So, so we're working through various sort of questions that we get asked on a regular basis in our training and topics that we think of, of.

Of interest and a value for our listeners, really. And this one is going to be a particular favorite of mine. And also one for the sales managers. I'm pretty sure. Cause I know when I was a sales manager, if everyone, one of my sales team used to say this to me, it used to make the veins of the back of my neck, stick out my blood boil, really.

So, so it's that phrase that we hear from time to time from a salesperson and it's my order is stuck in purchasing. And I can't get it out. So I want to explore that today. What does it actually mean? Because that has significant implications to our forecast and to our revenue projections and potentially our manufacturing schedules and all those things.

So what does it actually mean? And then what are the real causes of that? And how can we mitigate it as well? So some nice meaty topics to get into today. So [00:02:00] Jonathan, I'm going to start with you. So when a salesperson said to you, Or dare I say, you may even have said it yourself, and I'll I did. Entirely guilty.

I definitely said it when I was a salesman. Yeah, same. When we say the order stuck in purchasing, what do we actually mean by that? Well, that is a really good question. I thought so too. It's interesting. So Most of the companies we work with I think I, I, you know, they, they yeah, they, they, well connected with science in some ways, shape or form.

Absolutely. So we're normally talking to scientists and I would like to propose that what often has happened there o often has happened, is the conversations have ended with the scientists and sometimes with some pretty senior scientists, I have to say. Even up to director level I, I, I, I could say mm-hmm

And. And we've been working away with the scientists. We've done a fabulous job convincing them that our solution is the one for them. As far as they're concerned, yep. They've, they've obviously spoken to people internally. They've got [00:03:00] themselves funding. And you know, and they've, they've now done their bits.

I, you know, they've, they've, they've made their brand choice. We probably have that news. Probably celebrated that as a one order may even be in our forecast. And the next thing we hear from the scientists and we're, we, we have that conversation around, ah, it's gone into purchasing. So when we, when we hear that phrase for me, it's often because the conversations have ended with the scientists or are coming to a conclusion with the scientists.

And now. It's sort of entered the commercial piece. But of course, you know, where, where, where could I go next with this, this conversation? I think I think something to seriously consider here, of course, is that one of the things that, you know, sometimes we don't do enough of, and I, when I've said this, I know I've not done it I haven't engaged with, with purchasing.

So when, you know, I've heard that phrase, it's great. Got into purchasing. I haven't actually, I, [00:04:00] I did, I, I don't actually know what it means. So what does it actually mean when it's gone there? And it's kind of your question, Steve. Well, I'm going to, I'm going to stop you there and let Jayne have a go at that.

So when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, when we say it's gone into purchasing, what did that mean to you? What does it mean to you as a salesperson, as a business person? Okay. So I'm picking up from where Jonathan left off, we've celebrated because that, Ooh, the orders won, fantastic.

The order's being placed, it's gone to purchasing. And of course, everything that is going to be ordered has to go through a process that would actually enable something to be purchased, an order placed that would action the potential of making sure that there's funds available for that to offset against that purchase.

Yes. Order. So there's a whole aspect of areas on the customer side. So [00:05:00] for me when we're talking about customers and I've been so guilty of it, I've got some, you know, not too distant stories. A story, particularly, I've told so many people, particularly if they may well be listening of some of my big bloopers in that.

But I think what we haven't, what we've not understood is that customer buying process. And that's the challenge, isn't it? Because our technical, the person or the NGOs we've been dealing with we get such a wonderful rapport and a brilliant vibe and relationship with them. And we think that's everything, but even if we ask them sometimes what the customer buying process is, of course, they may not know either, which means that we have to go and visit some other people.

So there's some great points. Says, I think, first of all, the person we're selling on the people we're selling to in the lab or in the factory, they're kind of our kindred spirit. They've got the same academic background. Possibly we've got the same kind of organization. We've written similar jobs to us.

So we're, we're comfortable talking to those people, aren't we? They're the people that we, you know, [00:06:00] I always call them the men in the white coat. Yeah. They're like a kindred spirit, aren't they? But purchasing people are scary or known people that we don't have any, any they can be standing up or we go with it.

Yes. Well, that's what we're frightened of. Is it? So, I mean, you mentioned something called the buying process. Jayne and I'll take this up with you again, Jonathan. So we talk a lot in our training about sales process and that's another topic of another day. But what do we mean by the buying process of a company?

So, yeah, this, then this is where it gets interesting because this is for me, the steps that any organization goes through and it could be. The process could differ depending on, you know, what the organization is buying, but it's the steps it goes through to buy something at the end of the day. We often ask the question, what is your buying process to the, you know, to the scientists often ask that.

No harm in asking but all I would say is be careful about the quality of that piece of information that comes back. I always say in the same, same reason you would never go to the purchaser to ask about the [00:07:00] science. You know, why are you going to the scientist to ask about the purchasing? And what we'll often get is some sort of attempt to describe it.

So the scientists will describe, you know, broadly, this is what happens. And it's very easy just to take that as red, right? So that's, that's what happens. But of course, what do they do? They may describe some steps and, and actually in quite, quite good detail. And then at the end of it, they'll say, and then it goes into purchasing.

And we accept that as being a step. Yes. Instead of, you know, where I suspect this conversation will go very quickly is. Okay. You know, let's think about the timing of our engagement with purchasing to actually understand what that looks like when it goes into purchasing, because there are near nearly always a whole series of steps there, which are very infrequently understood by any of the scientists.

And that's no you know, that's no it's not a negative about any of the signs. Well, it's not their job, is it? It's not their job. No, no, no. That's, that's right. So, [00:08:00] so this for me is about timing of the engagement with purchasing, you know, when do we engage? And I know we've had some previous podcasts around that have touched on this topic more than once.

Well, let's go, let's come back to it because I think it's, you know, it's a really important point. So, so Jayne, when, you know, when is the best time to engage with purchasing in that case? Well, I personally think as early as possible. And sometimes I think that. You know, before, if we know we've got the, the sniff of a potential, we've been looking at a prospect, we know that there's a, a need, we've got some interested parties.

I would say let's, let us at least introduce ourselves to purchasing, just to say, Hey, I, I, I'm looking at the potential of a piece of equipment in X, Y, or Z area would love to know a little bit more about the process that you have when an order is looking to be purchased, when an order wants to be placed.

So I would say as early as possible. I know other people disagree because there might be a little bit wary of what that might mean, but [00:09:00] for me, it eliminates so many possibilities or challenges and risks that we face if we don't And it's not just about knowing who purchasing are, it's actually have we met them, have I talked to them, do purchasing know me would be the question I would ask myself you know, and then we can find out a lot of things.

So my, I have fallen foul of Terms and conditions having done a lot of work with customers, it actually didn't repeat itself. It was a one time really big mistake and it held up an order for months and months and months. Having already talked to the buyer and gone through everything and I knew at the back of my mind and I was like, Oh, this will be fine because I've been speaking to the buyer.

But lo and behold, it got, it got held in purchasing because then they wanted to check through all the Ts and Cs and it's been a big memory and it comes up in all of my training. Be aware of this. Well, it's super important. So I think there's some, there's some really important points that you, you [00:10:00] know, we've just gone through.

I'm going to explore those in a bit more detail, but the first is, you know, purchasing isn't. Some kind of AI deep thought computer. Now there are still people, people call purchasing. So, you know, having had some kind of relationship with them and actually knowing who they are and they, and they knowing who you are, as you say, Jayne, I think is, is, is super important, isn't it?

Really? Because people buy from people you know, that's a cliche, but it's, but it's very true, really. And I know if I was you know, a senior purchasing manager and I got a phone call from a salesperson that went along the lines of, Oh, hello. Yeah. You don't know who I am, but you've got my order on your desk.

Can you sign that order off for me? Thank you very much. Bye. You know, I put down the bottom of the pile. It'd be the last thing that I'd like to look at. Yeah. Wouldn't you Jonathan? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes that's exactly where it goes. Because. I think one of the things we have to check a salespeople is, is the relationship that the scientists, engineers, the clinicians, et cetera, that we're working with, what is their relationship with purchasing?[00:11:00] 

You know, I've, I've had cases where purchasing weren't even aware that actually, you know, they were going to be, they were going to be placing an order for X, Y, and Z legitimately, they were trying to buy X, Y, and Z. But purchasing weren't expecting it, you know, so, so what's happened there? Well, actually what's happened there is that their own team have not followed their buying process.

And what have I seen too many purchases do in those circumstances? Exactly what you said, Steve, it goes to the bottom of the pile and it's deprioritized or they deliberately hold it, you know, and they hold it and they hold it until Yeah, they, there's more noise, you know, we ring up again or the scientists chased it because, you know, they wonder what's going on.

And, and actually what then happens is purchasing, take it all the way back to the beginning of again, you know, to go through the process to, you know, educate their own, their own team, you know, on the process, the buying process is there for a reason, you know, without it, it would be, you know, [00:12:00] anarchy business will run out of cash, you know, extraordinarily quickly.

You know, if it, if it didn't have a buying process. So, you know, there's some internal education, some internal things that, you know, we need to, you know, be very conscious of, you know, when, when we're selling, whether it's instrumentation, a large services deal, you know, consumables it doesn't matter, you know, they'll have a some sort of system people might may or may not be involved these days.

But in many cases, people still are involved. I think so, particularly for a major purchase or a, you know, a major contract or something. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah. So not knowing who purchasing are, and you, and you make a great point, Jayne, about, you know, getting involved and engaging with them early.

I've never been thrown out of a lab or an office or a factory for saying, can I speak to somebody in purchasing? So, so you think, you know, would you go as far as saying that the first time you meet the end user, You'd also try and get a set of meetings so that we're purchasing as well. Would you try and do that?

Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And I've always found purchases. I [00:13:00] mean, not every purchaser, but the majority of purchases are very willing to have a conversation and to have a meeting, have a sit down. They want to know that we are capable, that They want to know about our company. If they are going to be signing off and placing an order with us, they want to know that we are trustworthy enough to, to deal with that in a timely, professional, organized manner.

And I, I think trying to get in there early is so important. I've rarely been turned down when I've asked to see the purchasing manager or depending on what I've been selling the, you know, the person that's dealing with the purchase of a CapEx, you know, and actually I think they may be a little bit easier to find.

Of course, some of our companies are global, so they may not be in the same country that you're based. So, you know, we have to then use every other mechanism to be able to be in contact. If they are in the same country that you are, then, you know, I've had really good coffee meetings with [00:14:00] purchasers, and I've had a few purchasers say, Reps rarely come and see us.

I think they might be a little bit afraid of us, you know, but we don't get to see that many people. We quite like seeing people. So I made a note of that. And next time I took donuts with me. So, but, but it is, it is key. They are there. They're people that are doing a job and they want to know that they can trust us and our company too.

I think it's very important. Yeah, because you know, I ran a training course a couple of years ago, remote training course with a company that is a US company, not that that matters. But one of the, one of the people on the course said, Oh, purchasing, they're the enemy. And, and, you know, no, they're not.

They're part of the process. Yeah. Maybe they may have a, you know, it may be not be the easiest people to do it sometimes, you know, when it comes to negotiation and things like that, which will. Talk about another day perhaps, but they're not him and me and me. They're part of the process and and Jonathan, I think, you know, Jayne alluded to there that it's not just about purchasing, get a good, getting a good deal.

Of course that's part of their job is to get, you know, best value for the organization, whatever that [00:15:00] means. But they have other functions, don't they? All the things they have to think about as well. They do. It's, and it's a very broad based, you know, a purchasing professional you know, has got a role in many ways, you know, very similar to us.

You know, I, I have this fantastic slide in my training, which shows, you know, the role of the purchasing professional. And I think a lot of salespeople are very surprised by it. Yeah. And when it, you know, because sometimes all, I think it's very easy sometimes to think, well, all they're, all they're interested in is.

The price actually, when you really understand what their role looks like, you realize that it's far from that there are many other aspects to their role and, and you know, and I think that's what keeps us, you know, sometimes, you know, prevents us this fear of. Oh, gee, they're just going to negotiate harder and harder and harder with us.

If we make contact actually, there's a lot more to their role than just that. So I think it's one of the reasons that keeps us out is one of the reasons we end up not really understanding what those final steps are. There may have been several steps in the buying process that [00:16:00] lead up to a submission of a series of documents inside an organization then has to go through the purchasing function.

But it's then understanding those, those steps, the timing of those steps. Yeah, to, to, to really, you know, understand how long it's going to be in there and it could be days, it could be weeks, it depends on what you're selling limits you know, in terms of the size of the, the purchase that's being made in terms of, you know, the amount of money being, being, being being spent, it could be type of spend there's normally You know, multiple signatures required and I know it's easier than ever to get hold of people, but if somebody is on holiday, somebody is away ill, that can delay it you know, have they got all the, all of the information they need to be able to, you know, to place an order.

Yeah, we'll have served the scientists beautifully and given them every single thing. Have we done the same with purchasing until you speak to them? You just don't know. No. And you know, every time they're missing something or something's not getting signed, you know, a day's added, a [00:17:00] day's added. And then of course, what happens?

We get to end of quarter and it rolls over by a couple of days. Right. And that that it causes issues. So, yeah, it's a, it's a, yeah, I think that engagement with engagement with purchasing and early is just it's just everything for me. And when I do the training on forecasting, I, you know, one of the things I say right up front is if you want a longer successful career in this industry, guys, be great to forecasting and, you know, deliver what you promise, whether you're salesperson, sales manager.

It's good. VP of sales, whatever and one of the best ways of being good at that

is to get close to purchasing. Isn't it? Absolutely. Yeah. And you know, they, they get stuck. I mean, we think about how our order is stuck in purchasing, you know, purchasing gets stuck in the middle here of the side of us as reps or the sales people, you know, pushing purchasing. Can we get that order out?

Where is that order? Where's my order? Put purchase order and their technical people within their own company, who maybe had a timeline in terms of [00:18:00] when they wanted some goods delivered. So purchasing can be stuck in the middle, trying to sort out all the really important things to make that happen. But they're getting shouted out by on both sides here.

We can, we can actually avoid that by some of those early conversations. Yeah, that's right. I mean, you're thinking about sort of purchasing of, I don't know, say in a factory you know, hypothetically a car factory, if a purchaser decided because you could get a better price in theory to change to another supplier, I don't know, tires, for example, then that company can't deliver tires or the tires tend to be defective.

You know, the, the worst, the best that's going to happen is going to delay fact manufacturing. It could even cause a quality problem. These are all things that purchasing get involved in, aren't they really? Yeah. So, so what can we do then Jonathan to, to mitigate these? You know, we've already said about getting to see purchasing early, but what does that mean in practice?

You know, we're going to see a purchasing manager really early on in the sales process. Yeah. What are we going to talk about? So. I think I'd probably, maybe it's too simplistic, but I would divide [00:19:00] my customer base into two. Okay. Those accounts that I'm familiar with, that I've done business with, that I understand and I know and, And I would, you know, a top tip to any salesperson you know, who, who is, you know, doing business through a, you know, a, a number of accounts, right.

It probably, you know, say they've got, you know, 10, 15, maybe 20 top accounts you know, that they regularly do business with for me. You know, because you're doing business regularly you should be, you know, working quite closely with purchasing. You should really be taking the time to understand what the buying process looks like for everything that they buy.

You know, and understanding what those steps are in detail. I've, I'm, I must admit I've never had an issue with anybody telling me. Well, what those steps are, what I've asked the question because of course, what a purchasing, what they want me, they want you, they want any sales person to be compliant with the process.

Yeah, absolutely. And in some, in some cases, Hey, what do we end up doing as [00:20:00] salespeople? We educate the scientists, the engineers, the clinicians on how their own buying process works. And we can help navigate them through it. And that's a brilliant thing. So I think with existing accounts for me, it's, it's really get.

You know, those that you regularly do business with, you really have to set yourself, it's a great goal to set, to truly understand what that buying process looks like and when, and when it goes into purchasing, you know exactly what's going on in there, how long things take, the signatures required, maybe locations of the people involved, the roles of people.

And I've, I've heard some awful stories, you know, of, of things going wrong at the last minute because that process wasn't understood. So I don't know if Jayne, you want to go with this one on the new customers. Cause I've just simplistically split. Yeah, no, I'm not Jayne. So what about everything?

Something we've never done before all the time. [00:21:00] Well, for a new customer, we're going in blind in some way. So we've got a lot to find out early because we may have a really exciting piece of equipment that the technical or. Scientist or the end user really wants to use what we don't yet know is, you know, is there a preferred supplier list, you know, do we need to be on a supplier list?

Yeah, because if we, if we're starting to only think of that right at the very end and we needed to get onto that supplier list, that may take some months because there may be references, a lot of background checks on us. Let's find that out early days. And that's why I think people will want to see us, particularly if we are brand new into an account.

You know, make purchasing the second person that you go and talk to, or the second conversation that you have when you've got that information out, because let's find out what we've got there. And, and here we start to build up that information that we need about their buying process. You know, who, who can, who can, you know, they buy from?

Can they buy from us? Is there anything that prevents [00:22:00] us? Do we align with their terms and conditions? Or are we going to have to say, you know what, when it comes to that, we can't agree to this. You know, can they agree to what we have? And of course, very, you know, current topic is, are we a sustainable company?

Because they will have some really big requirements now on the sustainability question. Will they want to work Okay. with our company because of our sustainability you know, policies, but there's many more, many more. If you listen back to a listener to an earlier podcast with a general called GT and army from Aston University that I did last year, he talks about this a lot and the importance of this really.

And if you don't have a sustainability policy you're probably not going to sell to many leading organizations, universities, companies. In the next couple of years, because they're all asking for it and expecting it rightly, rightly. So so yeah, there's some really important points really there. You know, if we're not on the supply list and the very best is going to happen is I'm going to go through a process to get put on the [00:23:00] supply list.

It might be that it's just a, you know, a deal blocker, you know, you can't buy from me, end of, move on. It's not only can't buy from you we can't pay you either.

Thank you. Is another Steve. Thank you, Steve. A guy, Steve once said to me remember it is a gift until it is paid for. And of course, you know, making sure we just do simple things like get the invoice address. Correct. Right. But the invoice is formatted correctly. And, you know, those are all. Important discussions that, that we need to have an, a part of that it's in purchasing.

You know, do they know where, do they know where to, do they even know where to send the invoice to? Okay. Cause as you said, Jayne, sometimes purchasing is in another country and it could be in Poland or States or, or anywhere really. And of course, if we're a global team, our colleagues in those countries can help us.

Yes, absolutely. Of course, you know, work with them really. So, so Any other thoughts then as to [00:24:00] why salespeople don't engage with purchasing? Leave a review on that one. Why is that? Are we just frightened? Yeah, I think it's that fear aspect because we've talked about it here, haven't we? And I think in so many Of the sessions I've been in, people see, you know, we, we've got a really good level relationship with the people that we are talking technically with, and we see commercial, like somewhere massively, you know, out of this world.

Are they too far away? Are they going to be really tough on me? Are they wanting to drive my price down? We have this. Perspective. We have this thought that actually they will do anything to hinder, you know, me getting this sale. Actually, it's the opposite. So I think we've just got this wrong perspective of what, you know, purchasing are about.

I always look at what titles people use these days when you're a salesperson, you know, my, in my early days, it was always sales representative, you know, but there's all these [00:25:00] titles now that people use. To describe the job they do and one is a common one is account manager. Of course, I'm an account manager.

Well, if you're an account manager, this is what you expected to do guys. He still understand the account. And part of that is to understand their purchasing department and their, yes. And they're all ready, isn't it? Yeah, definitely. I mean, the other thing that I find that sometimes block salespeople is actually not fear per se of going to purchasing.

It's actually, what do I say when I get there? Yeah. You know, I've had, I've had so much training. I do lots of planning and preparation around my, my scientific engineering, sort of clinical conversations. How, how much time as a salesperson do you sit down? How much time do you spend sit down and think about the conversation you're going to have with somebody in a purchasing role?

Who's whose priorities, whose motivations, whose interests will look completely different to a scientist and, and, and, and quite. Naturally. So, so I think preparing the conversation is a, is a good one. If all else fails, I [00:26:00] know we've shared this before on a previous podcast, and I think it was one I did with prove Steve.

Again, we were talking about purchasing. She likes to use the word help. Please, could you help me? I used, I love to use the word advice called purchasing up early in the sales process. Although I've got a funny story about that shortly. If you, if you let me share it and you know, and ask.

No, look, I'm, I'm, I'm going to be visiting your organization. I, you know, I've got an appointment to visit such and such. I'm, I'm calling for some advice, really. I appreciate you'll have a buying process here. I'm keen to follow it. What, what, what advice could you give me? That word advice.

You know, human beings love giving other people advice works on the basis of the word help, which I really love to. I mean, both work. But that's a way to open up the conversation, but, but look, if, but listen, you know, if you're struggling with this, just take some time to understand their role. Okay. Just have a look at their role.

It's, it's very broad. There were so many ways we can actually engage with them. So many things to talk about. Well, we [00:27:00] can start asking some questions, can't we? Yeah. Yeah. And Hey, yeah. Like any of our customers they've got, you know, they have motivations to buy, they have goals they have things they need to achieve and are we helping them achieve their, their goals, you know, taking their pains away, et cetera.

So helping them solve their problems. Yeah. Love that. Yeah. One always used to well, for me or I used to like to use was, if you were me, what would you be doing there? ? Who would you be talking to? Yeah. What, yeah, what, what, what haven't I done that I need to do? Yeah. And, and, and you make a great point, Jayne, earlier on about terms, conditions, to me, that's, that's the one that's the biggest showstopper in terms and conditions agreed upon.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is that, yeah, that's really, know one of the, you know, having worked for large American corporates where, you know, perhaps with. Less flexible than some organizations or what the terms and conditions are from, from our side and then, you know, not, not anticipating those and not talking about those early on, it might seem presumptive to be talking about terms conditions before the deals almost been agreed, really, but why not?

[00:28:00] Yeah. Hey, sorry, Jay. Sorry. No, no. I, so I, I now think cause I've fallen foul of the terms and conditions sort of black hole moment. I, I view terms and conditions now and did after that just as important as, and we often leave these things closer to the end of this. Our sales process is also a site survey, you know, we're selling a fantastic piece of equipment.

I used to sell some really large equipment that would struggle to get through some doors. So if I've sold a fantastic piece of equipment or Getting along that line and people are loving it and then it's like, well, actually, I need to do a site survey. Let's do that quite early because if we can't get the thing in the building, then they're not going to be buying it anyway.

And it's the same with terms and conditions. So early days, make sure you can get it in and make sure that the services could be, at least be provided that are required for that piece of equipment or [00:29:00] whatever, whatever it is, consumables, they've got. Storage enough, you know, hold in the quantities that you need to sell.

Yeah, particularly for cheap lift and things like that. Absolutely. And terms and conditions for me fall into that bracket. So they happen earlier because if that's a deal breaker, then we're wasting so much time and we're disappointing the people that we've been talking to that are really excited about working with us, you know, so.

I can think of a, of a story of that where we're, you know, we delivered a mass spectrometer to a university where the department was on the side of a very steep hill and you could probably gather, work out the rest of it in terms of trying to get the thing in, I think they had to set doors off eventually to get it actually delivered.

But that's another story for another day. Jonathan, we want to hear your funny story before we finish. We do. All right. I once employed a very talented young lady. She was great at selling. But she had an interesting background because although she was selling, you know, in a, you know, to a, to, to a group, to, to scientists that wasn't [00:30:00] her first, that wasn't her, if you like, first academic qualification.

She, she had a degree in business and, and I remember when I hired her, she was relatively new to selling and you know, she went through her induction program. Made some appointments to go and see some customers and I was going to spend some time with her as her manager in the field. And we went to this large chemical company.

I was expecting to visit the users. And meet them? No, that's not where we started. We actually started in purchasing. And it, and it was Love her already. Yeah, it was, it was her background. That, that, that, you know, her background was the, was the driver. She actually felt more comfortable talking to purchasing than she did the scientists.

Which was, which is actually not a thing you usually see. But as you can imagine, it got me thinking. So anyway, I thought that was amusing, but not, not everybody may have done. I think it's great behavior. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's, I think it's brilliant. You know, if you early, early days understand the strategic relevance and the [00:31:00] strategies within the company, you're understanding way more than most.

Salespeople can do throughout the whole of the sale that directs everything. Great, great points. Thank you, Jonathan and Jayne. Some super points there today. So, so if you do have a a project which is quote stuck in purchasing, hopefully there's some ideas of what you might want to do. Yeah. You go and talk to them to try and move things forward.

And you know, just remember, I've never got thrown out. None of us have been thrown out of a customer for asking to speak to purchasing. The worst that ever can happen is, I don't need to talk to you now, but thank you for calling. So it's always a good thing to pick up the phone and remember they're not the enemy.

Yeah, true. Apart. They're part of the process. We'll be back again in a couple of weeks time. So Steve, another podcast. So Steve, oh, go. Then you got another, you normally ask for the pearl of Wisdom before we finish. Oh, go on. Yeah. Okay. One more thing. And I've got one more thing. Steve, I just to wrap up, can I just add one more thing?

You may or may not be a pearl of wisdom. The one more thing that I would love to add and. And, and Jayne, Steve, you've both touched on this is purchasing are often [00:32:00] great enablers. You know, they're well connected through an organization. They know lots of people that can get things done that might need to get done.

And I was just thinking of, you know, trying to get a big instrument into a place or a stores that's not large enough, you know, they'll, they'll help you find a way, right? So, you know, never, you know, always bear that in mind. They're normally really, really well connected because actually their job. Means, you know, they have to be well connected to do their job well, so they can get a lot of things done for you.

Okay. Oh, I'm glad you agree. Good. Yeah. And just to show we don't rehearse this beforehand. I have now got to wrap up by saying thank you to the listeners for joining us. We will be back again in a couple of weeks time with another podcast, but in the meantime or at least something for you to be aware of Jayne and I will actually be on a LinkedIn live on the 7th of February.

I think Jayne, is that right? That is correct. Steve. Yes. And would you like to say a bit more about what we're going to do on that one? Well, the exciting, we're going to [00:33:00] have a, one of our topics that we discuss all about our goals, business versus personal, but very importantly for everybody that has entered the competition, we're going to be announcing the winner of the free training.

So do, do sign in for that. That would be very exciting. A hat and draw the names out of something like that. Yeah. I'm going to have a full jazz band behind me. We've had a great entry. Yeah. I entered as well. Yeah. We've got well over a hundred I think. Really good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's great. Like when they do the FA Cup draw.

Only this time we're not going to draw Tottenham this time.

It's getting personal now. We'd better stop there. Thank you for joining us, dear listeners. We'll be back again in a couple of weeks time. Until then, happy selling out there, and we'll talk to you [00:34:00] soon.