Why having competition in sales is good news!

In this week's show Steve Vaughan is joined by two of his sales training colleagues, Pru Layton and Jayne Green. Having competition in technical B2B sales is inevitable and part of the job; however it is also good news! The team discuss why having competition helps you "sharpen the saw" and why competition doesn't necessarily mean another supplier. 

Steve Vaughan, Jonathan Cooper, Pru Layton, Christian Walter, Pascal le Floche and Jayne Green are Sales Trainers from george james ltd. You can email the show at: Podcast@georgejames-training.com

The trainers on LinkedIn:

Steve Vaughan https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-vaughan-salestrainer/
Jonathan Cooper https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-cooper-18716b1/
Pru Layton https://www.linkedin.com/in/pru-layton-b46a3528/
Christian Walter https://www.linkedin.com/in/christian-walter-a1857b1/
Jayne Green https://www.linkedin.com/in/jayne-green-salestrainer/
Pascal Le Floch-Riche https://www.linkedin.com/in/pascal-le-floch-220ba46/


george james training website https://georgejames-training.com/

Transcript

steve: [00:00:00] Hello again and welcome to the Luxury Choice, a B2B sales and business podcast brought to you by the training team of George James Limited. My name is Steve Vaughan. I'm a senior sales trainer with George James, and I'm also the host and producer of this podcast. And today I've got Pru Layton and Jayne Green, my two colleagues, two training colleagues from the George James team.

steve: So Pru, Jayne, how are you both? How was your weekends? Even with you? 

Jayne: Yeah, very good. Thank you. We were celebrating a birthday not mine. But one of my sons. That meant two sons were in the house and it was fabulous to have them there. And then it was interesting cleaning up afterwards. 

steve: Yes, they're grown up sons, we should point out, aren't they?

steve: They're grown up sons. But they 

Jayne: cook, oh, great. Amazing, so yeah, it was a lot of fun. 

steve: Useful, yeah. And how about you, Pru? 

Pru: I actually managed to get out in the garden because it was glorious. So I started all those spring jobs of cleaning things out and tidying up, which is, my my husband always gives me jobs which are about cutting things down or tidying things [00:01:00] up.

Pru: I'm not allowed any jobs which are nurturing. 

steve: Oh, great. 

Pru: He calls my approach to gardening slash and burn so a bit like 

steve: mine really yeah But Yeah, it's yeah It's like something like a large animal's gone through and eat everything in the garden when i've been to gardening i'm not very i'm not very delicate.

steve: Shall we put it that way? It was a lovely weekend It was we were up in the lake district and the weather was incredible actually. In fact, it was almost It wasn't quite short weather, but it was certainly t shirt weather. It was amazing. We had a boat trip on Lake Windermere. We were up visiting my late brother's ashes are scattered up there and it would have been his birthday.

steve: It was a family trip and yeah, it's just a beautiful part of the world when there are one or two times in the year when it doesn't rain in the Lake District, of course, and apologies if you do live in the Lake District. That's just a personal experience. Anyway, let's not talk about the weather too much.

steve: Too much today. Let's talk about our topic we've got in hand for today. That's about the competition. So we've called this podcast, why is having competition, i. e for the sale, good news. Now that's going to sound very counterintuitive and a bit sort of bonkers, to lots of [00:02:00] people, but we generally believe that when you're in a selling environment, having a competitor is really good news.

steve: But why do we think that so I want to get your first line thoughts on that So i'm going to start with you Pru. Why is having a competitive for the sale good news for you as an individual as a salesperson? 

Pru: We go into sales because we're naturally competitive yeah, most people move out of a particularly in the technical science space from a academia or lab environment And we miss a bit of we're attracted to that competitive side of being able to Show that you're good or whatever and I think if that element was missing I think the job would be a lot less satisfying I mean my last lab job.

Pru: One of the reasons I moved on apart from the company car thing, but apart from that It was I could work really hard all week at the bench and nobody noticed Fast [00:03:00] Or I could do very little and nobody noticed. And I think in sales, we like to be noticed. We like our successes to be celebrate and broadcast.

Pru: So it appeals to people who are naturally good at sales, I think. So I think that's why competition is essential, not just good. I think it's really important. 

steve: So it's almost like the thrill of the chase and the coming out on top against your peers and your competitors, Jayne.

steve: Really? Is that what we're saying? 

Jayne: Yeah, absolutely. It keeps you on your toes, doesn't it? It's that very thing that you you're then aware that it isn't just you selling your product. Getting to know your customers. Somebody else is also getting to know those same customers. Funny that, yeah. As a product.

Jayne: So it makes us sharper. If we allow it to, I think it makes us sharper because we have to be aware of more than just ourself and our product, which is what we start thinking about. I think when we start our journey in sales, we're starting to think a little bit wider. There's other people here that could get this business.

Jayne: [00:04:00] Super point, yeah. And and I like that. It sharpens us up. 

steve: Sharpens the saw another Stephen Covey habit. Yeah. I agree with the competitive nature stuff if you've ever played sport with me of any format, you'll know that i'm a terrible loser, you know I have broken the odd tennis racket I have kicked the stumps down before now when i've been given out by my brother who was on piring at the time and I have been known to walk off the golf course in years gone by.

steve: Yeah, that competitive element is definitely, it's definitely in there in me as well. Although my competitive ability is usually far higher than the actual ability at the sport I'm playing. But that's a, that's another story. So competition, I guess we've all worked for businesses at some stage in our career where we've had unique selling features.

steve: We've had things that, make our product almost the only game in town really, but that's not normal really. And I think in this day and age of ever increasing technology, I think The days when businesses or products are completely without competition, I think are very few and far between. So I guess we're always going to have competitors in the normal world, aren't we, Pru?

steve: Yeah, it's [00:05:00] just the normal state of business really, isn't it? 

Pru: And I think you raise a really good point there, Steve, in terms of, we have moments sometimes with a new product release where we have a momentary time where we maybe do have something that stands out, but it doesn't last long, and if in a sales career, you live for those moments, then the other 95 percent of the time is going to be really tough because you're only going to have 5 percent of your time when actually you've got like something amazing.

Pru: And isn't it. Isn't it true that when you talk to a customer In a competitive sale. And you say, what is it that you're looking for? They list the best things from every single competitor. So they say, I must have this and I must have this and I must have this. And so your job as a salesperson is to weigh up what you have that differentiates yourself from the competitor that brings more value to the customer.

Pru: And it's just, that's the fun of the job. And I think [00:06:00] internally we've all. No, we'll work for businesses that have come out of a great scientific idea. And what we do know is that that These companies, these organizations reluctantly have to get sales people on board because they think that they think, Oh, this is so amazing that people will be kicking the doors down to buy this and then they go, Oh, they're not so in terms of delivering value inside the organization, you want to be in a competitive environment because the organization recognizes that it is.

Pru: What you bring and raises the whole profile of being in sales if it's order taking anybody can do that 

steve: Yes, 

Pru: it's no fun. You want competition because it makes your job fun. Yeah makes my job fun 

steve: Yeah, I agree Your thoughts on this one do you? 

Jayne: Yeah, absolutely. I think there's there's a real watch out, isn't there, for those, that five percent of time [00:07:00] when you feel like you have no competition.

Jayne: Or, we've, and COVID was an interesting, wasn't it, because people came out, and if people had a product that they'd bought prior to that, Then in the rush of COVID they and through that time they bought that same product because they knew they could trust it. And so what then happened is of course, is the danger for us as sales people in that position is that you think, okay, my product, products are flying, I can do no wrong, I can sell loads.

Jayne: And then of course things change and customers really do want choice. I don't like buying something. If I want to go and buy something personally. Actually I'm rubbish at shopping, but that's another story. I would like choice. At least, one or other, I don't want just one, this is the only thing that's available.

Jayne: I want to be able to test something out. So when, we then realize that we've got to work out to actually bring our product, like Pree said, prove our value, it's really good for us. It's [00:08:00] switching on all of those parts of our brain that start to get fired up, start to become really interesting.

Jayne: And I think if we become way more interesting, we become more invested in the product that we're selling when we've got competitors to sell again. That's a 

steve: super point. Yeah, absolutely. And I think you make a really good point that when we're customers. How do we behave? I know when I'm in the market with something because I'm a resource investigator Actually, I should be sure to go before me any further just recognize that sadly Meredith Belbin passed away this week Which was very sad to read.

steve: Although he lived a fine age But obviously resource investigator is a Meredith is Belbin profile, but I love researching. I love downloading all the PDFs, comparing them, and I will go and compare and contrast. And our customers do the same thing, really, and that's why I think when there used to be a school of thought in sales that said, don't mention the competition, don't ask about the competition.

steve: Yeah. [00:09:00] And I don't agree with that. And I see you're laughing, Priya. You don't agree either. Now, when should we ask about whether the customer is looking for anybody else at this stage? 

Pru: If you follow our process of qualification of any sales lead, it's then, so part of the qualification process, you've got a, you've got someone who's demonstrating an interest, but the first thing we need to do as a sales person is work out, is this really a sales opportunity, i.

Pru: e. is there a. a chance that this will proceed to a sale, a decision, a purchase being made. We talk about qualification and so qualifying the lead to convert it to an opportunity. And one of the key things we talk about is understanding the competitive landscape early. So I think, we should be confident to have that discussion with customers, who else are you looking at?

Pru: It's a very simple question to ask and I think, it means that we can understand [00:10:00] from the outset if we're being brought along to be truly evaluated fairly, whether we're just making up the numbers. And whether we've got a real chance really important if you're afraid of your competition Then you're not going to be as successful as you should be in sales Deal with it.

Pru: It's one of the one of the things that we are really good at dealing with 

steve: Some super points and it and I think that the feeling was Don't mention the don't ask the question who else you're looking at because the customer is going to say nobody should I be and of course in the day of the internet and ai and google and stuff, you know You're literally two clicks away from finding out the whole gamut of competition out there really so but I think there's a really good point there Jayne from a qualification point of view that if We are up against a really strong competitor in this particular account.

steve: They may be a preferred supplier We may, they may have real technical, logical. Benefits over us [00:11:00] we may not it may not be our best product in the product range We probably want to know that straight up. Don't we really 

Jayne: yeah, definitely and it's about the best use of our time And you know asking all of those questions right at the beginning finding out as much as we can and if we start to sense that they We've got to They've got a product that they're looking at that they've used continually.

Jayne: We know that they're preferred. We might want to, of course, trial that through the system. If we have got a newer product or we've never actually done any business in there, we might want to test that out. And that's generally, a good conversation to have with your manager. Do we want to test this out and see how far we can go?

Jayne: It might actually give us a little bit more information about them as a company, but generally, we may be one of these things where we have to say, actually, Mr. Customer, I, I appreciate that you really love this other product, and it might be the moment that we say, at this time, we may not be the best solution for you, or, we, and we bow out.

Jayne: But in a [00:12:00] right way, to save our time, if we think we're going to do all of this work, and at the end of the day we know that they're going to buy the competition, then we could be spending, we could be saving ourselves months of work. Great points. That's a hard one for sales people. 

steve: Particularly new sales people, I think, to understand.

Jayne: We want to win everything. And actually, yes, we want to. Players, if we're going to win every single time, and that's a brilliant mentality, but the reality it's exhausting and demoralizing when you know that there's stuff that you could have find out right at the beginning. And, we save ourselves some time and heartache, actually, and rejection.

steve: Yeah, super points. Yeah it's hard for particularly new salespeople to understand, but. There's no prizes in sales for coming second. You don't get anything for a silver medal apart from, learning experience really. And one of the best things to learn in sales is to lose fast and lose early.

steve: If we are going to lose the sale, it's best to lose right at the get go and then focus our efforts and time and resources and [00:13:00] money on things that we're more likely to win, then spend all our time chasing what. Probably wasn't really going to happen at the start and then at the end say funny enough We didn't win it, did we?

steve: Because as I say, there's no prizes in coming second, really. Priya, what are your thoughts on this? 

Pru: Yeah, I was picking up on what Jayne said really, you know If you're going into someone's shown an interest and do you want to say if we really got a chance if they've used the same supplier For a long time and suddenly you're being invited to partake in this Next buying cycle, we're allowed to be a bit cynical about it as salespeople And I think asking about You know In that instance your competitor is the incumbent supplier 

steve: Yeah, 

Pru: so being you know, what would I need to show you?

Pru: That would make you change who you currently use 

steve: super question 

Pru: and if you don't know at the outset, how can you frame? The whole sales conversations that follow on from [00:14:00] that to put you in a better winning position I think don't be afraid of the competition Understand as early as you can what that landscape looks like in terms of How you're going to set out your store, what areas of value you're going to look for and explore with the customer that favor your solution, because the truth is that there is choice and actually the choice is pretty reasonable for most customers.

Pru: So it's always this balance, isn't it? And this is where as a salesperson, ultimately you make the biggest difference. It's not the spec. I think we make the biggest difference in successful sales organizations. I've always said, give me a mediocre product and a great sales team, and I'll do so much better than a great product and a mediocre sales team.

Pru: I think that's so true. It's the salespeople that really can make the difference. 

steve: Yeah, I think that's a super point. And this podcast is called the Luxury of Choice. So we call it that because. The [00:15:00] idea is that we'd, you're so good at prospecting and finding opportunities, you can pick the good ones.

steve: But it also works in this context as well that we have the choice. We don't have to compete for every opportunity that comes along. There's nothing wrong in saying, thank you very much, Mr. Customer. But this time, we know we're not right for you, or dare I say, you're not right for us. It might be a strange concept to think about, but we don't have to chase every sow really.

steve: Something that popped into my mind while we were just talking then, of course. I'm talking here about competition being another manufacturer and other supplier and other salesperson, but there is all the forms of competition that aren't quite so obvious, really what are our thoughts there in terms of how we could also be facing competition that isn't necessarily Another product another supplier and other vendor.

Jayne: So I we often find you know We I think we sometimes and people have often not asked the question I don't know. I was guilty of that because we assume we so zoom in on the competition being somebody that's like us And we think yeah, we're the only [00:16:00] person in there or with a favored person and then you realize You the ultimate scenario is you wait for the order to come in and it's Oh, actually the other department also were in the mix for that money and they actually won the money.

Jayne: So the competition was a pot of budget that wasn't just going to the people that you might've thought that particular person you might be talking to, but it may have been shared money. And they're real big things that we can find out early on in the sale about budgets and about what competes with that money, which I love that question.

Jayne: Actually, who else might use the money that, that is coming in that you're applying for? Does anybody else, can anybody else steal it? I think that's a great one because customers quite like it. Nobody's going to steal my money, but I know the other department want to use it too, it's a super point 

steve: really. And, for this podcast we unpick little bits of sales and sales process because all these things are actually reality on LinkedIn [00:17:00] and and asking the question about the budget. What inexperienced salespeople often get confused by is just because there's a budget, it doesn't mean there's the cash available.

steve: And I can think of examples where in my career where there were five or six budgets, but there was only one pile of cash and they were all competing for that cash really. And it was my job to make sure that, my my customer's budget had the best chance of winning that cash. What other form of competition could we face, Pru, apart from competing for the money?

steve: Is there any other kind of competition we could face? I 

Pru: think, I don't know, it's a bit of a stretch really. But I guess they're inter, sort of internal competition sometimes about who's the who's the, who's got the loudest voice in the organization Yeah. As well. Who's the best sales person internally, perhaps?

Pru: Yeah. That internal, backing the right horse, because often it, it kind of allies to these multiple budgets. If you talk to most. scientists, they will always tell you that their project, [00:18:00] their purchase is the most important in the whole business. That's what they believe.

steve: And 

Pru: they're passionate about it. They're passionate about their work. They're desperate for something new usually because they're managing with something that's less than optimum. But, there's often another more influential voice inside that organization. And I wonder often how hard we can be.

Pru: Pursue finding out who that is, because it may not be somebody in the lab. 

steve: True. 

Pru: Very good point. It could be somebody elsewhere in the organisation. They're out of their comfort 

steve: zone, they're not waiting somewhere in a different part of the building. It's not the man in the white coat, as I say. 

Pru: No, and that can be, that can be Unless you are open to thinking about it, it can often steal what looks like a rock solid opportunity.

Pru: And It just goes and you have no idea why it's gone. I, I think that could be something that's a challenge as well. 

steve: Yeah. Yeah. We think that the purchase of the new [00:19:00] whatever for the lab is the biggest priority for the organization, but actually they want to resurface the car park or they need some new photocopiers or they need new company cars.

steve: And and we just don't understand that really. I think another form of competition as well is another technological way of doing the same thing. Because in, yeah, in our business of, scientific sales, I could think of examples, say in my own career, where if somebody was trying to measure the water content of something, they could possibly do it by coefficient hydration, but depending on the nature of the sample, they could also do by loss on drying and there's pros and cons of each way.

steve: So competition could also be, another method or another way of getting the same. outcome and sometimes people actually don't understand that one as well. Yeah. 

Pru: The other way is less smelly than Carl Fischer, which is.

steve: I love the smell of pyridine in the morning. Actually, it's got, it's a nasty chemical, so don't go sniffing pyridine.

Pru: Don't do this at home. That's 

steve: the health and safety disclaimer for today's show. Yeah 

Jayne: I think people, use is that they're using their [00:20:00] internal resources, aren't they? Often. So I used to sell microscopy, like a micro microscopes and, widely in the lab and then. At one point in my selling, I sold cell counters, all automated.

steve: Okay. 

Jayne: And of course, people, you'd go in, and it was like, actually, how can you justify the price of this cell counting that's brilliant, when, I can actually just get one of my lab techs to sit in front of a microscope and count cells. It takes a lot longer, but I don't have to, they didn't cost in people.

Jayne: They're using the resources that they've got. So that can sometimes be the competition that we get. That you face in, in, in your selling role. 

steve: Have you ever been in a situation where you've moved from one company to a direct competitor in your career? I think you have proved, haven't you?

steve: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Not on one occasion, Steve. And how did that work out for you when you went to see the customer and one day you're wearing one hat, the next day you were working wearing a different hat. How did that go for you? 

Pru: I think it, it helped the fact that we [00:21:00] haven't mentioned this yes, and it's probably really important while I would encourage anybody who's listening to not fear asking about the competition, what we should never do is.

Pru: Be rude or dismissive about absolutely. And so it's not our job to do that. So we should always, favor our products, the ones that we're promoting and representing be aware of the competition, but I don't want to get into a discussion with my customer about the pros and cons of a competitive product.

Pru: So when I have. on more than one occasion, move from directly from one competitor to another. I was very lucky that I got that advice early in my sales career, actually, because I thought it's something you should do, but it's not. So when I have moved apart from being teased relentlessly by some of my customers, there's a story, I'm sure Steve knows this story, where I moved from one competitor to [00:22:00] another.

Pru: And when I visited one of my Good customers from my previous company. First of all, he was quite rude about seeing me because I'd moved and then he eventually agreed to. And when I got up to his lab office he said made me put a lab coat on with traitor written on the back. Ha. Okay He was just teasing me so as long as you have been professional in terms that's the word I think yeah being aware of the competitor, but not being Dismissive or negative about them that I think you can do that, but you have to have those Honest conversations with customers because that's life, but no, it's fun when you move.

Pru: What's really terrifying is that when you go to a direct competitor, it's suddenly they show you everything. And you I certainly for the first few weeks thought, Oh, I shouldn't be looking at that really weird feeling. That's why I lost that sale. Yeah. Pricing and. And [00:23:00] what they said about my previous company, very interesting.

Pru: Have you ever had 

steve: to done that, Jayne? Have you gone from one supplier to another? I've gone 

Jayne: from working within a company that sold other people's products to actually going to manufacturers. 

steve: Okay. But I've 

Jayne: also got within that environment, I remember very clearly, within working in this company that had multiple products, we took on one product line.

Jayne: And we were selling heavily on that product line and, we were, we knew who the competition were and they were a big name. And then, a couple of years later, the company took on that product as well. So we've been selling against them. Now, suddenly we're selling that as part of our portfolio.

Jayne: Yes. Where it had been a competitive sale. Now they were also one of my big three in, in, in my portfolio of products and it's so true. You cannot be disrespectful about the competition. We can be super curious and that would be my thing. 

steve: That's a great way of looking at it.

Jayne: Curious about everything that. [00:24:00] The competition does and why that works so well for a customer. Be careful how we ask all those things, by just by being curious and asking a lot of questions, we can find out more about what works for the customer and it's not always about that piece of equipment when we boil it down to it, maybe the.

Jayne: Because it's about, actually Joe Bloggs who sells that has been so helpful, Pru said earlier, so our curiosity can be our best friend. It's a great point, yeah, it's a great point. 

steve: And we've got a slide that we use in our training decks, and I'm, I can't remember where it came from, but it basically looks at the main drivers of why people buy from you.

steve: Companies in a B2B sales environment. So obviously companies are buying companies, but it's people that are actually doing the buying. And the main reasons are price. It's not brand. It's not the product performance. It's the sales experience. Really, it's what we do. Getting on for 50 percent of the reasons that people go back and buy from that company over and over again is The sales experience, which I know sounds a bit waffly, but what it really means [00:25:00] is the sales person's honest, authentic, gives good advice, stops them making mistakes, trustworthy gives good opinions, all that stuff that, I guess we've all built a career on really.

steve: One last question on this, and I think we've covered this before, but I think it's a good point to bring it up again, really. I think we're going into qualification a bit here as well as the competition. But I want us to imagine the scenario and we've all been there. We're bombing down the motorway at legal speeds, of course, and the phone rings.

steve: And we don't know who's on the phone, so it goes to answer machine. And then we, of course, pull off the motorway and call the customer back. And the customer says, Ah, Steve, yes, thank you for calling me. You don't know me, but I'd like a quote for one of your products. I've been looking on your website, and I'd like a quote for product XYZ.

steve: Can you get me a quote by tomorrow? And we think great. We're gonna lead everything. Oh, yeah, fantastic Yeah, can I find a bit more about what you're doing? No. No, I just need a quote Can you get me a quote tomorrow? Okay. Thanks. Bye How do we handle that one because I'm sure [00:26:00] we've all you're both laughing and I know we've all been in that situation First of all, what's going on there Jayne?

steve: What do you think is really going on there? What's the customer doing? 

Jayne: Typically you're that third quote that they require. Of 

steve: course we are. Of course we are. 

Jayne: When they don't want to know anymore, they're not interested. In fact, I think it's quite generous that you said, I want the quote by tomorrow.

Jayne: I remember many instances years ago where they were like, I need a quote by the end of the day. 

steve: Ah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, completely. Yeah. So the purchasing person has told the guy in the lab, or might even be the purchasing person, you need to get three quotes, make sure you're getting a good deal.

steve: Yeah. Okay, so we all know what's happening, but what would you do in that situation, Pru? How would you handle that one? Would you do the quote? 

Pru: No, of course I wouldn't. Oh, interesting. 

steve: Okay, why not? 

Pru: Because I really worry, you think, it's When we're in sales, we get really hung up on this word, yes.

Pru: Yeah, that's fine. Yes, I'll do that. Yes, that isn't a problem. And we want to please and we want a problem solved for the customer. [00:27:00] So when it's almost hit back on you in terms of they want to quote and you know what's going on, but you don't want to say, no, you can't have one. But you do not want them to have one under most circumstances.

Pru: And the reason I say that is I worry about what happens to that quote. 

steve: Okay, that's a good point. 

Pru: If you go in it, eyes open, going really not serious, but it's really rude to turn down. And they might, they might think I'm not a very nice person or not a very good organization. Number one, what price do you put on the quote?

Pru: Good 

steve: question. 

Pru: You've got nothing to work on, so do you go in at list price, or do you go in at the best deal ever and just hope it provokes a conversation? How do you know? So if you go in at list price, and it goes into purchasing who've clearly asked for this, They'll look at you as a potential supplier and go, they're quite expensive.

Pru: Probably never deal with [00:28:00] them again. It's like you're putting your stall out with building no value, no conversation. Maybe they are really tied into one supplier. The supplier has said, look, I can do you a slightly better deal as part of the negotiation if you can show me a quote from another organization.

Pru: So you're pricing. May well end up in the hands of your competitor. You don't know that. 

steve: Absolutely. I haven't thought about that. So how do you 

Pru: price it? How do you know who's going to have eyes on it? And it feels just really risky. So depending on all sorts of things, I'm happy to have a bit of an upfront conversation, to be honest.

Pru: And say, look, this feels like really late in the process. I'm imagining, as part of your process, you may have to get more than one quote. And that's making me feel super uncomfortable. Because, say what you think. I think in sales we sometimes pull back from actually saying what's in our minds.

Pru: These are people too, they know they're being cheeky. They know they are. [00:29:00] 

steve: Some wonderful points there. And it's 

Pru: I'm actually in a bit of a conju here. Because I don't want to say no to you, but I'm very reluctant to say yes, because you really haven't had the opportunity to evaluate us seriously.

Pru: And it's quite a lot of work to put this quote together and I've got to get it past some internal processes. You're not on our system. How can we move forward here? And I would actually make it the customer's problem because I think they've been cheeky. 

steve: I love all that. And I think that's, that's the voice of, dare I say, of many years of experience in sales and sales management, because I think as a young salesperson, I definitely would have done the quote.

steve: Whereas now I would absolutely have the conversation that says, look, I know you need three quotes. What is it you need? What's a bare minimum I can give you. If I did this for you, what are you going to do for me in return next time? You're going to give me a chance to compete is probably the way I would handle it.

steve: But I think your point about where does that quote go? And by the way, we could have had the same conversation about a tender that you weren't expecting as well because how many salespeople spend days and days working on tenders. [00:30:00] That they're never going to win because they didn't even know it was coming in the first place.

steve: But that's another conversation for another day. One last thought from both of you on competition. Any last gems or thoughts about embracing your competitor? Not literally, of course, but how to welcome the thought of the competition. Any final thoughts maybe with you? 

Pru: So I think from a customer and a business point of view and a sales point of view, actually I know that having good competitors out there was also good for me as a salesperson because it meant the business I was working for was investing money in bringing out new products.

Pru: One of the really tough things in sales is when you don't have anything new to talk about when you're like you're trying to, you're trying to polish something that's been around for a while, make it sound fab. So there's a driver within the businesses that we work for that competition mean that our business stays sharp, our business invests money in bringing new products and new solutions and new offerings.

Pru: So I think we should also welcome competition from that point of view. 

steve: Great points. Final thought from you, [00:31:00] Jayne? 

Jayne: Yeah. See it as an opportunity to grow, if you've had. had training at any time and you're selling. It would have come up at some point, in any training where you've been on boarded and you're talking about technical equipment or you're talking about the competitors all of a sudden, when you are faced with some competitors, in a competitive selling environment, or you have to lean on something that, so go back to, The training that you've had to go back to some things that go actually, what do I need to apply right now in this situation?

Jayne: And it really helps. It helps us to grow and develop 

steve: super points, Jayne proof. Thank you for sharing your thoughts today on the competition. Dear listener, if you've enjoyed today's show and you want to know more about the three of us, then the best place to find that is our LinkedIn profiles. You can find out all of our career history.

steve: You can find out what the company the pro used to work for before she went to the other company as well. Somewhere on our LinkedIn. I'm sure it's in there somewhere. If you've enjoyed the show today, then please make sure you subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast [00:32:00] app. And please also don't forget to give us a nice five star review on Apple.

steve: Or Spotify does help us in lots of mysterious ways. I should just mention that we've now updated on the George James training website scheduled training courses throughout the year. So these are courses where if you have a new person or you've got so many of the team, you just want to upscale where you can send them on a scheduled training course, that would be on a course with other people from other manufacturers.

steve: They're running in the UK. They're also in France now and also in Switzerland and Germany, and hopefully sooner later this year in North America as well. I'll be back in again in a couple of weeks time where our topic is going to be why as a sales manager don't all my sales team respond to me in the same way.

steve: Funny that, isn't it? In the meantime, happy selling out there and we'll talk to you 

soon.