The Dangers of the Corridor Conversation

In this episode of The Luxury of Choice, Steve is joined by Jayne Green and Christian Walter to discuss the concept of corridor conversations in sales, exploring their significance, appropriate topics, and the potential pitfalls. 

They emphasize the importance of professionalism, curiosity, and relationship-building during these informal interactions, whether in-person or virtual. The conversation also touches on the dynamics of meeting in different environments, such as labs versus coffee shops, and the importance of post-meeting reflections to maintain rapport with clients.

Steve Vaughan, Jonathan Cooper, Pru Layton, Christian Walter, Pascal le Floche and Jayne Green are Sales Trainers from george james ltd. You can email the show at: Podcast@georgejames-training.com

The trainers on LinkedIn:

Steve Vaughan https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-vaughan-salestrainer/
Jonathan Cooper https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-cooper-18716b1/
Pru Layton https://www.linkedin.com/in/pru-layton-b46a3528/
Christian Walter https://www.linkedin.com/in/christian-walter-a1857b1/
Jayne Green https://www.linkedin.com/in/jayne-green-salestrainer/
Pascal Le Floch-Riche https://www.linkedin.com/in/pascal-le-floch-220ba46/

Jonathan Slasinski https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-slasinski-449a655/

george james training website https://georgejames-training.com/

Transcript

Steve Vaughan (00:00)
Hello again and welcome to The Luxury of Choice, a B2B Sounds of Business podcast brought to you by the training team of George James Limited. My name is Steve Vaughan, I'm the host and producer of this podcast and I'm also a member of the training team. And I'm here again once more with two of my colleagues. Today we've got Jayne Green and Christian Walter. Jayne, how are you? How are things?

Jayne Green (00:20)
Yeah, very well. Thank you, Steve. It's been a while since podcast, so good to be here. Well, I'm not sure about that, but you know.

Steve Vaughan (00:25)
We've all missed you. Yeah, it's not been the same without you. ⁓ Great to have

you here. Yeah, great to hear. And Christian, how are you?

Christian (00:34)
I'm good, thank you very much. had a very busy week. I was training a foundational selling skills course on Wednesday and that was always a highlight. Lots of eager young...

Steve Vaughan (00:44)
Good, as were you, Jayne, of course,

as well. Yeah.

Jayne Green (00:46)
Yes, so two days of that also for me, which have been ⁓ brilliant.

Steve Vaughan (00:51)
Great stuff sales management and leadership for me this week. it's starting to get that sort of end of year rush of lots of things happening, isn't it? It's always my favorite time of year. is not just because of we're busy, but there's always lots happening, lots going on, isn't there? Apart from the weather getting a bit lousy. Well, that's a, that's a consequence of living in the Northern hemisphere, but still that's what it is. So we won't be wittering on any more. Let's go on to today's topic. And that's a slightly different one for us today. And I think it's it's a really interesting one.

going to really interesting to hear what you think about this YouTube. So the topic is the dangers of the corridor conversation. It sounds like a thriller or an Agatha for Christie movie or something like that, not. It's something we need to be aware of as technical salespeople. So I think to start with, we probably need to define what is a corridor conversation. So let's start with you, Jayne. So what do we mean, do you think, by a corridor conversation?

Jayne Green (01:43)
Well, I think we can think about it in several ways, but just from the, ⁓ the line that you've given us, you know, it's like that conversation that can we, we can so easily fall into, we may have met the customer in their reception or at a meeting point and we're strolling along down the corridor with them to get to the lab or, their office or some place to have a discussion. And, ⁓ we end up having, sometimes diving in very quickly.

all about what we talk about and how we start that conversation off as we're walking. And I think it's really important to discuss.

Steve Vaughan (02:11)
⁓ okay.

And I guess on some sites, some of the big pharmaceutical type sites or those kind of things, the walk from the reception to the lab or to the plant or wherever we're going can be 10 minutes, something like that really. It can be quite a walk, can't it really? So yeah, interesting. And I guess, of course, we've to go back on the way out as well. So Christian, anything different thoughts from you as to what we mean by corridor conversation?

Jayne Green (02:31)
Easily, yes.

Christian (02:43)
I think it's wider than just the walk to and from the lab or to and from the meeting room. It's also, you know, maybe an opportunity at an exhibition to have an off the record conversation with your contact, with your customer. It's before official discussions start or after official discussions have finished. And in my opinion, it's...

Steve Vaughan (02:57)
Okay, yeah, yeah, no thought of that, yeah.

Yeah.

Christian (03:09)
also an opportunity because it often is easier to get the real information from the customer off the records or outside the meeting room.

Steve Vaughan (03:16)
That's interesting. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So are we saying then that even though we haven't officially started the sales meeting or sales visit, it's still, we still need to be, you know, professional and fired up and ready to start thinking about what the customer is saying to us right from the get-go. that, is that what we're saying?

Jayne Green (03:38)
Absolutely. think we, you know, we often talk about our first impression and it's the first impression a customer may have if we've not met them directly before, you know, so we're building up that quick rapport, we're trying to get to know that customer, you know, quite quickly, maybe in some of these instances and these conversations before we get into the official meeting, I think are really important to be very strategic in thinking about what we

Steve Vaughan (03:46)
Yeah, good point.

Jayne Green (04:07)
what we talk about, what we don't, and our curiosity in those moments can peak to its greatest.

Steve Vaughan (04:14)
Right. All right. So I guess, you know, I'm the customer. I've just come down from my lab, shall we say, and I've walked through the corridors and I'm now in reception. Nice to meet you, Jayne. Nice to meet you, Christian. We're heading back towards the lab. What kind of things are appropriate for us to be talking about and what kind of things aren't appropriate? What do we think?

Christian (04:35)
I think in these moments I would keep it general at the beginning, maybe ask about how business is going, how the staff is doing, whether they're busy or whether there is not a lot of work, these kind of more general topics to bring the person at ease a little bit and also signal your interest.

Steve Vaughan (04:54)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Christian (05:02)
And maybe you walk by a production plant and you could ask, hey, what is it you were doing there? Or what's the point of these storage silos? So just show your interest, but don't go into the selling, into the qualifying yet. I don't think that would be appropriate.

Steve Vaughan (05:15)
Mm.

Yeah. So what's your budget? What's the time scale? What's the application? And are you the person with authority?

Jayne Green (05:24)
Yeah.

Steve Vaughan (05:27)
Hopefully not, no. And some of the things I can think of that I've done in the time that I've seen people do as well is, know, if we've had like a difficult drive to get there, know, oh, my drive up the M6 has been murdered today and you won't believe what the traffic's like. And they took me half an hour to park anywhere. You know, we're laughing, but I've heard people do that. I've probably done it myself, to be honest.

Jayne Green (05:46)
Yeah.

Yeah. And the customer's thinking, I don't actually care. And also maybe thinking, I do that journey every day, five days a week. ⁓ Absolutely. Yeah. I think it's that bit we can, we can sometimes moan about things in that moment, can't we? If we're kind of not ready and prepared. And for me, it all comes down to how we've prepared before, even we've, you know, before we've even got in our car.

Steve Vaughan (05:50)
No, exactly.

That's a point. Yeah. Welcome to my world.

Yeah.

Jayne Green (06:13)
for the whole meeting, hopefully the day before or a few days before. I think that orchestrating, but also being real in those moments, this is a chance for us to be, we're not in the deep meeting that could be getting really understanding the negotiation or the proposal, or even fully qualifying what it's all about.

Steve Vaughan (06:13)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jayne Green (06:37)
We've got a real opportunity to walk alongside another human being that, you know, lives and breathes and eats as well. You know, so we hope, you know, so we can have a meaningful conversation that helps us to get to know them a little bit more. You know, let's understand who we are going to be sitting in front of, you know, yeah, for maybe whatever we've planned, a 45 minute meeting, we've got some opportunity now to see who this real person is.

Steve Vaughan (06:46)
Hopefully. ⁓

Be a real human being.

I think that's a super point actually. Yeah.

Jayne Green (07:07)
you know, to pick up, you know, how they work,

how they communicate. Do they like small talk? Do they not? You know, it just helps me gauge a little bit about what that meeting might be looking like, you know, when we get to the place.

Steve Vaughan (07:20)
Yeah,

love it. Yeah, yeah.

Christian (07:22)
I

think you know there.

opportunity really at the beginning as you walk towards the lab or the meeting room is to establish a connection, ⁓ establish credibility and of course you know if you have some joint acquaintances I think it's maybe an opportunity to talk about them or if you've been to the same university. So this all helps us to build rapport with the stranger which otherwise we might not be

Jayne Green (07:32)
Yes.

Steve Vaughan (07:34)
OK.

okay.

Jayne Green (07:47)
Yes.

Steve Vaughan (07:48)
That's a great point.

Christian (07:51)
get so

quickly and I think that's an opportunity in this before the meeting starts because it's time that is considered okay to talk about such topics whereas in the actual meeting maybe the customer expects you to be more business-like.

Steve Vaughan (08:11)
Sure, sure. And so I guess we're sort of saying like, oh, does Dave Smith still work here? I used to go to university with Dave Smith. He used to play football with him and all that kind of stuff. Just, I need to just reach up and plug my camera. I've realised I haven't plugged it in, so it's going to die in a second. So I'm going to ask you a question while I reach you for it to the camera. But just from a sort modern world perspective, talking about cameras actually.

Christian (08:20)
Yep.

Steve Vaughan (08:36)
Whilst we of course always want to make ourselves calls face to face, sometimes of course we're having to do them virtually for various reasons. So how does this translate to the virtual world? If we're making a call over Zoom or Teams, we don't have a corridor conversation, but we still do, I guess, have to be real human beings. What are our thoughts on that?

Jayne Green (08:54)
Yeah, well, and if you know that there's more than one person likely to be in that meeting, sometimes we have that waiting period, don't we? You know, where you're waiting for somebody else to join. It's always that moment of not making that awkward. You know, if you're on a meeting with a couple of other people, we've got that opportunity to do the same thing. You know, what's of interest? I also quite like to, you know, find out, you know, what's interesting to them? What have they done? You know, is there anything new?

Steve Vaughan (09:14)
Yeah.

Jayne Green (09:22)
particularly if I've picked up something here from looking at LinkedIn, I've seen that they've got a big, you know, marathon trophy or sort of like badge around their neck. I like to find out about things like that. And again, we can do the same, you know, in that very beginning, the start of that meeting while we're waiting for everybody to get settled.

Steve Vaughan (09:33)
That's super, yeah.

I remember when we were in the deep of the COVID period, which five years ago now, incredibly, and running a training course for a company and the people assembled virtually. And one of the sales guys, I think it was from Denmark and people weren't using virtual backgrounds quite so much at the moment, which I do want to come back to. But when he came on, he'd got a load of vinyl records behind him. And of course I'm a music geek, as you guys know.

I immediately said, what kind of music are you into? And we had a to have a bit of a real human interaction for 30 seconds before we started training. So that's one of reasons why I don't like virtual backgrounds for that reason, actually, because it gives people a reason to have a conversation behind you. okay, so let's take it back into the real world. Again, just to submit the popped into my head while we talking, like your thoughts on this, Christian, when we're in reception waiting for the customer, do we sit down or do we stand up or does it matter?

Christian (10:32)
I always stand up. I always look at the posters on the walls. I study the KPIs that are sometimes there. I look at company brochures, perhaps, that are lying on the coffee table. So it's a chance to familiarize yourself with the company, with what they're doing, with the culture, maybe you can get a feeling. If there are all these signs.

Steve Vaughan (10:34)
OK.

Jayne Green (10:39)
Hmm.

Steve Vaughan (10:39)
Okay.

Yeah,

Christian (10:59)
about do's and don'ts, you know,

maybe you realize, it's quite a strict company. If there's a lot of corporate branding, then you understand, it's very corporate environment, you know. I think it gives you a chance to learn more. And I think standing up, it gives a more active impression.

Steve Vaughan (11:08)
Hmm. ⁓

Hmm.

You're greeting?

Jayne Green (11:20)
Totally, yes. I really hate sitting down waiting anyway. But yeah, you're ready. You're ready for the customer. You're anticipating the customer coming. And it's so much smoother, isn't it, to be able to greet somebody when you're standing up, when they're suddenly standing up and you realise that you're sitting down and they're looming over you. It's not a great place to start, but you do pick up the culture right from in the reception normally.

Steve Vaughan (11:28)
Yeah.

Yeah, the six feet eight. Yeah. Yeah. ⁓

Jayne Green (11:47)
of an institute or of a company that you go into.

Steve Vaughan (11:47)
That's a great point.

I can remember sitting and waiting for customers sitting in those days, you know, before I knew any better and not knowing who the customer was. And somebody would come to the reception and you stand up and put your hand out and it's not the right person. That's slightly awkward. Oh, you're not there. Well, okay. So I guess another reason why we're standing up. So another thought, I think we've touched on this one before, but let's just, you know, just explore it again.

Christian (12:00)
you

Steve Vaughan (12:15)
Pros and cons of meeting the customer in their lab or their factory as opposed to in say a coffee area or a restaurant. What are our thoughts there?

Easy for you.

Christian (12:25)
I'm a great

proponent to go to the lab or go to the process environment because you can learn so much there from just looking around.

Steve Vaughan (12:32)
Okay.

Christian (12:37)
This will also trigger some good questions for discussions you can have with your customer. You can see how many people there are, know, are they young, are they old, are they using gloves, are they not, are they operating computers, are they writing stuff down manually. We can learn so much that is going to be relevant for our sales discussion. ⁓

Steve Vaughan (13:00)
Okay.

Christian (13:01)
But also I think the other advantage of having the sales discussion in the lab is it is a less formal setting than if you're sat at a conference table. And I believe sometimes people give away more information or more...

Steve Vaughan (13:12)
That's interesting.

Christian (13:18)
are more relaxed when you're standing in front of a chemical bench and you're talking rather than looking each other in the eye, particularly. And that's often the case in our industry that the scientists are quite often introverted people and they don't feel comfortable in this formal meeting situations. And it's sometimes easier to find out good information when you're standing.

Steve Vaughan (13:35)
Mm.

Interesting.

Christian (13:46)
landing in the lamp.

Steve Vaughan (13:48)
You had a slightly different view on this when we were talking beforehand, Jayne, or you added some additional info, we say? Do you want to just say that?

Jayne Green (13:52)
Yeah, I mean I do

agree with Christian. I'm an advocate of getting into the lab and seeing what's going on. It's nothing like that because you see for real, you know, what it is and what's happening. However, I've recently been training people that have said a lot of meetings are now in coffee shops or they actually give people the choice and they go out to a coffee shop and I was initially thinking, I'm not sure you can't see what's going on.

Steve Vaughan (14:04)
Yeah, of course.

Jayne Green (14:20)
But their point was, ⁓ it's a really valid point actually, you take somebody out of their normal environment. So you're on very equal territory, which is actually also quite a nice thought. So it's giving them a bit of a breakout from that moment within their own company. So they can start thinking in a slightly different or clearer, or maybe even a broader perspective, taking them outside of their environment. And particularly if you're buying the coffee, you know.

Steve Vaughan (14:36)
Okay, yeah, see that.

Jayne Green (14:47)
I mean, it would work with me.

but yes, it's just another thought actually that I think there is some times when that's really valid for some customers to take them outside their environment. But that also, I then would really want to go back with them and go, I'd love to have a look around. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.

Steve Vaughan (14:54)
I can see that. Yeah.

Yeah, be nosy, yeah, go poke around.

Yeah, and that's a really interesting perspective. I had to thought about that. I guess there's a couple of caveats there. Obviously the location has to be appropriate. And in some organisations you wouldn't be allowed to buy the coffee, I think, because of the workflows and all that kind of stuff. But yeah, I think it's a really interesting perspective. So back to the dangers of the corridor. Oh, sorry, Christian, go on. yeah. Sure, yeah.

Jayne Green (15:13)
Yes, of course, of course.

True. Yeah.

Christian (15:26)
So, know, just let me quickly add a thought here, Steve.

So I believe if we can get the customer into a restaurant, be it a coffee shop or for lunch, and depending on the culture, you know, it's not in Western Europe, we don't take customers for dinner, but in Asia, they do it all the time. And I think the aim is always the same, to bring the customer out of their stressful environment.

Jayne Green (15:39)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Steve Vaughan (15:47)
Correct.

Yeah.

Jayne Green (15:54)
Yes.

Christian (15:54)
where

there are lots of dos and don'ts and lots of norms in the coffee shop, in the restaurant. These rules don't exist so much.

Steve Vaughan (16:03)
Yeah.

Christian (16:03)
⁓

It's an opportunity to show our appreciation. Of course it needs to be within the compliance guidelines of the companies, but typically a launch is not outside the compliance guidelines for most companies I know. And it's an opportunity to learn more about the person and not just about the business. And if we have that opportunity, we should take it.

Steve Vaughan (16:11)
Yeah, very much so. Yeah.

Jayne Green (16:11)
Yes, of course.

Hmm.

Yes.

Steve Vaughan (16:27)
That's a really good point actually and cultural variations do apply in some cultures. I guess it will be expected almost that that happened really. So yeah, thank you for making that point, Christian, certainly. So back to the dangers of the corridor conversation. What traps can salespeople fall into then in the corridor conversation on the way?

Jayne Green (16:39)
Yeah

I'm happy to take that off because I know I've fallen into it so many times, Steve. And particularly when I first started selling, I was so excited. I loved the job and I was so keen and wanting to talk to customers with everything I knew, of course, it all was wrong in that environment, that I was so excited the minute I met the customer that would be walking down the corridor or the long walk to their office or the lab.

Christian (16:48)
I can't believe that.

Yeah.

Jayne Green (17:11)
and the conversation of the meeting would start. And then it was going quicker than I actually could think. And I hadn't got my prepared notes with me. And they're saying some really interesting things. I can't even make notes. And I do remember, it's really embarrassing, stopping at one moment and just saying, do you mind if I just get my notebook out, middle of the corridor? And I'm like, yeah. And it felt so strange. And it was really the wrong thing to do.

Steve Vaughan (17:31)
Like a reporter, yeah.

Jayne Green (17:39)
I could have just said, but of course in my naivety, just said, this is fantastic. I'm really looking forward to, you know, are we meeting in your office to having this meeting, this conversation and discussing this further. That would have been a really gentle way of handling that. But we can get so in depth of the conversation that the meeting is almost done by the time we get to the, you know, to the office. Yeah. And we haven't covered our objectives. We haven't actually understood.

Steve Vaughan (18:01)
⁓ we'll head back now then.

Jayne Green (18:08)
who we're speaking to, why, if there's other people involved. And we've started a conversation and maybe other people were going to be part of that meeting. And it can be a real interference and a really bad start to a great meeting that you've got planned.

Steve Vaughan (18:22)
I think we've all done it Jayne. Have you done something similar in the past Christian?

Christian (18:25)
Yeah, I think there's a danger of sticking with small talk and that's actually a wasted opportunity. mean, a little bit is maybe necessary depending on the cultural background, but don't...

with it for too long, the customer will be bored, you miss an opportunity to find out something important about the company, about the person, about their problems, challenges. So I think, you know, talking about football has its place, particularly Northern England.

Jayne Green (18:44)
Hmm.

Steve Vaughan (18:59)
Why Northern? What's wrong with the Midlands? Sorry, clearly not the Villa Fans Gets.

Jayne Green (19:00)
Absolutely. It's not a thrill of fun, it's okay.

Christian (19:03)
I just

remember going to Middlesbrough and having a very enthusiastic Middlesbrough supporter as a customer there. But no, I think it's important to get back to business at some point or at least vaguely towards business.

Steve Vaughan (19:12)
I won't do football.

Yes.

Jayne Green (19:18)
Hmm.

Steve Vaughan (19:20)
Yeah, we do. And so I think, you know, to summarize what you both said, and I agree fundamentally with that, let's be human beings. We walk along the corridor, let's listen to what the customer is saying in case they do give us any useful nuggets, but let's not get into trying to probe the customer asking deep questions until we do sit down in front of the customer. And one of the things we talk about in our training, the training that you guys have both just delivered this week, in fact, actually in our foundational selling skills is

Jayne Green (19:32)
Hmm.

Steve Vaughan (19:48)
we have to adopt a meeting leadership mentality when we get in front of the customer. It's our job to take control of that meeting. You know, we've asked for the meeting. It's our job to then take control of the meeting, ask the questions, probe for information. And we do have a process for doing that. But if you want to know more about that deal, you're have to come on one of our training courses. So, okay, so.

Christian (20:08)
Absolutely.

Steve Vaughan (20:11)
We've had a really, hopefully really productive meeting with the customer. We've found out all about their needs, things they'd like to do better. We've hopefully agreed a course of action for the next meeting, if there is one. Of course, we've got to go back to reception now. So are there any things we need to be mindful of on the way back to the reception from the lab?

Christian (20:33)
I think it's a super opportunity to find out the stuff that's not said in the meeting. How is his relationship with the other stakeholders of the buying unit, perhaps? If there is some animosity or somebody who is blocking, there might be some kind off-the-record information. Jack is not very keen, he's always worked with such and such. This is kind of information that you can get after the meeting.

Steve Vaughan (20:39)
such as.

okay.

Right.

Christian (21:01)
provided

the person who walks you back to the reception is quite a friendly person towards your cause. It can also be a real sign of commitment if one of the bosses walks you back, happened to me.

Steve Vaughan (21:08)
Yeah.

Christian (21:15)
a year ago about in a big company in Germany and the vice president of that division walked me back to reception and I think that was a super sign of respect as well and an opportunity for me to kind of follow up and you know maybe look forward and so it's a real good opportunity and it's also a great opportunity to make peace if the meeting

Steve Vaughan (21:15)
Okay, good point.

Wow. Yeah, absolutely.

Jayne Green (21:28)
Hmm.

Christian (21:40)
was a bit controversial. Let's assume you negotiate it and tough negotiation leaves everybody feel a bit slightly dissatisfied, at least in my opinion that's the goal of a negotiation. So that's the good middle ground. Yeah, so and then the walk back is the opportunity to make amends as well and to make sure that there are no bad feelings left from such a heated conversation.

Steve Vaughan (21:53)
Yeah, win a win, also lose a lose a little. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jayne Green (21:55)
Hmm.

Steve Vaughan (22:09)
Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Anything missing, Jayne, from that?

Jayne Green (22:12)
On the other side of that flip, I think is don't undo the good work that you've done in the meeting by being a bit careless. Now thinking, well, now I can relax. That was a little bit intense. Or, you know, did that go according to plan? Don't start processing that in your head. You know, whatever you're processing, don't let that out of your mouth just yet. You know, get back to that point with the person.

Steve Vaughan (22:19)
Hahaha.

Jayne Green (22:36)
⁓ in a really sort of good way, but you know not processing out loud about how you feel or you know good or bad, but it's a really it's great extension. It's still a rapport moment isn't it? How we are before and how we are afterwards is really really important, how they meet us and how we say goodbye.

Steve Vaughan (22:49)
We're still, yeah. Absolutely.

We're still, you with a customer, we still need to be professional. We need to keep our standards up, particularly if we're just in a negotiation. don't start walking off and say, well, we could have given you another 10 % if you'd have asked us. You know, that kind of letting our standards slip really. And again, I've probably done it myself and I've seen it happen in the field as well. And when we go back to reception, is it perhaps just, you know, obviously shake hands and just, you know, just reconfirming just, you know, what we've said we would do.

Jayne Green (22:59)
Yes.

Hahaha.

Yeah.

Steve Vaughan (23:24)
at the end of the meeting, would that be appropriate as well? You're both nodding.

Jayne Green (23:27)
Yep, yep absolutely. Yep.

Christian (23:29)
I think that's a good end, yeah. That's a good end

of any meeting.

Steve Vaughan (23:33)
Yeah, yeah, no, Krishna's.

Christian (23:36)
reiterate

what you agreed upon in the meeting room perhaps and then shake hands and say your farewells.

Steve Vaughan (23:44)
Totally. Yeah. You know, just thanks. Just to confirm once more, I'll be, I'll send you an email to, to confirm this as well, but we'll see you again next Tuesday, week on Tuesday, three o'clock with my product specialist. We're going to do that demonstration. He's nodding and shaking. ⁓ I'm not sure I not even shake his head. Not even shaking your hand at the same time. Yeah. ⁓ any, any, anything else generally that we've missed then in terms of the corridor conversation, any other final tips for anybody listening to this, particularly those of you.

Jayne Green (23:52)
Yes.

Yes.

Steve Vaughan (24:11)
this thing's going new to sales.

Jayne Green (24:13)
I think for me the whole thing is, particularly in the corridor, be super curious. Be open, have a look around. We talked about picking up the culture right at the beginning from sitting in a reception, but walking down the corridors you tend to see the awards that companies have got, you understand something of their compliance. But they've probably done some great things and had some great achievements, I think, of some of the...

Steve Vaughan (24:21)
Yeah.

super.

Jayne Green (24:40)
the areas I used to sell in, you know, some years ago, and they were doing incredible research or they'd manufactured some incredible products. And of course, the people in the company proud of what they've done. They're proud to work for them. And it's celebrating that and picking up, you know, seeing what's down on the walls in the corridor. But also, you know, you may walk past some of those now glass ward labs and you can see what's in there, you know. And I think it's you are in the customer's territory.

Steve Vaughan (24:45)
Yeah.

Christian (24:54)
you

Steve Vaughan (25:04)
Yeah.

Jayne Green (25:08)
Just remember that this is their

world. This is where they work day in, day out and respect that.

Steve Vaughan (25:14)
Great point. So your spider sense needs to turned up to 11, mixing my metaphors there so you can have a look in the lab as you walk by. And you make a great point as well about their products and their awards. So you and I have both recently done some training at Orderly Park, which obviously used to be AstraZeneca's research. And as you go into there, all their blockbuster drugs are on the wall, aren't they? Yeah. Which is always interesting. Always a conversation starting point. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. Final tip from you, Christian?

Jayne Green (25:21)
Yeah.

Yes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yes, absolutely.

Christian (25:40)
I also,

yeah, final thought for me, maybe if anybody's selling to academia.

They typically have their academic posters on the wall, which they presented at some conferences or symposia. And so this is an excellent conversation starter to talk about their scientific achievements and their research and what's going on and what's happening. then sometimes they stand there and explain the poster and their research to you and they can see the pride in their face. I mean, then this really helps you to

Steve Vaughan (25:46)
Okay.

Jayne Green (26:01)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Steve Vaughan (26:12)
Yeah,

I'm right to say, yeah.

Christian (26:15)
to live with a good impression.

Steve Vaughan (26:17)
Yeah,

I come across as a real human being. Yeah. Not some kind of sales bot, which none of us want to be, course. Yeah. Christian, Jayne, thanks very much for that. Had some great thoughts there. So if you're listening to us, dear listener, and you're planning to make a call, hopefully you're to make a call straight after this, listen to this podcast. Just bear in mind the things we talked about in terms of that corridor conversation. Don't let your professionalism slip. You know, be super curious.

Christian (26:22)
Mm-hmm.

Steve Vaughan (26:42)
Be a real human being. Don't start selling at least until you get into the lab. And just remember that is quality time with the customer that you just might not get otherwise if you don't make the most of it. We'll be back again in a couple of weeks time with another episode of the Luxury Choice. Just to say that we've been doing lots of exciting things here at George James Training. we have launched a new brand. So if you go to our website, you'll see we've got a very new logo. We've got lots of new

nice colors and all that kind of stuff, but lots of content more importantly on our website. And we've invested a lot of time and effort into what we call win selling. And win selling is the George James way of selling. There'll be lots more coming both on the podcast, on LinkedIn lives, on our website, basically any way we can tell people about what win selling is. But basically it's the way that we...

that we sell ourselves, also a methodology without being a framework. It's a concept for how people can sell and grow their business and continually keep growing their sales over the weeks and months ahead. But more of that to follow over the next few weeks. As I say, we'll be back again in a couple of weeks time. If you have enjoyed this episode, don't forget to leave us a review on Spotify or Apple podcasts. It does help us in lots of weird and wonderful ways. Have a great week out there. Happy selling and we'll talk to you soon.